QA with Judith Peeters, Operations Director, Hays Netherlands Viewpoint careers advice blog

QA with Judith Peeters, Operations Director, Hays Netherlands In this interview, Judith Peeters, Operations Director, Hays Netherlands, based in Amsterdam, shares her experience of gender diversity in the workplace, her progression into a leadership role and the Dutch survey results. What was your route to Hays? I studied neuropsychology at university and initially planned to have a clinical career using my degree. I soon realised this wasn’t what I wanted to do, and started working at Roozen Van Hoof, the recruitment company in the Netherlands which was acquired by Hays. I worked there for two years and then moved to an international B2B sales role, where I sold products to Proctor and Gamble. My next career move was to Sara Lee, I worked as a National Account Manager for the retail industry. After four years I moved to Coca Cola as a Sales Manager, this was my first leadership role. I then began working for Hays in 2007, within the Sales and Marketing sector. After four years my role changed to Regional Director and I was responsible for recruitment in the South of the Netherlands. For the last year and a half, as Operations Director, I have been responsible for the recruitment of all of the Netherlands. Tell us about your progression into a leadership role, what challenges did you face along the way? My first management position was with Coca Cola. I was younger than the people reporting into me, who had been working in sales for a long time. Being younger and female (in a male dominated sales environment) was a challenge. At the time I was trying to find my style as a manager. I found that for me it is best to be genuine, to combine honesty with empathy. My advice would be to find a managerial style that suits you, rather than trying to replicate another style of manager you have seen or had. Another challenge I faced, again relating to managerial style, was the balance of being ‘one of the boys’ but also distancing myself from my team so I was still viewed as the decision maker. This was and is more about personality rather than men vs. women. I have never viewed being a woman as a negative. The initial challenge I faced in my career was about adapting to a managerial level role but I believe that we never stop facing challenges because we never stop learning. You should remain open to change and keen to adapt, this will allow you to continue to progress. In your opinion is there a difference between how men and women progress in their careers? Yes I think there is a difference between how men and women progress in their careers, the difference in my opinion is because of circumstances and image. I think part of it is because of the image women have of themselves, an image of family life, responsibilities and abilities â€" which links to confidence. I don’t lack confidence. I believe I can do everything, which is important when in a leadership role. It also comes down to the fact that women are expected to stay at home and take care of the children, more so than men. If a woman comes back part time and works three days a week then she takes a step back in her career, which has an impact on her career path. It is important for couples to make a career plan for each other. If a plan is in place it may be that the man stays at home and it is agreed that the woman goes back to work full time to pursue her career and grow professionally. I believe women lack a career plan, or that it is not talked about enough. Have you encountered any gender specific obstacles in your career? I believe that there is a difference between how men and women work but I don’t believe these differences are obstacles. I think obstacles exist if you allow them to. Whether you are male or female it is important to make sure you are heard. If you feel less important or if you feel your opinion is less important this will be an obstacle. If you ensure your opinion is heard you will have an impact on the business you are working in and will be able to progress. Do you have any advice for female professionals who are in, or looking to work in, a leadership role? Make a plan for your career, think about where you want to go and where you want to be. Be authentic in your management style and believe in your management value. In the Netherlands, 51% of respondents said that their organisation did not have formal gender policies in place and 25% weren’t sure. What do you think are the implications of these statistics? These statistics lead me to believe gender diversity policies do not exist in businesses. Or if they are they are not being spoken about, which makes me think they are not working. Access policy is important, it is vital that companies have a diverse range of professionals within the company at a junior level. What you see, especially in Holland, is that there is diversity in top levels but less in junior roles, which will cause problems in the future. The implication of these statistics is that it is important to have diversity within all levels of companies. However, out of the respondents who said their organisation had formal gender policies in place, 83% feel they are adhered to well/fairly well. This implies that gender policies are valued in companies that have them. Is this something you agree with? These statistics show that if companies have gender diversity policies in place they work and work well. This makes it even more important to ensure gender policies are adopted and implemented by organisations. Globally, 48% of women do not think they have the same career opportunities as men. In the Netherlands only 42% of females do not think they have the same career opportunities as men. What do you think about this? Cultural differences are an important factor in how career opportunities are perceived by men and women. I think that in Holland we are quite forward thinking about a lot of things, so I am not surprised that we are a bit further along and that more women in Holland feel they have equal career opportunities compared to women globally. Demographically we are an ageing population and an ageing workforce. There are more opportunities for women to step in and pursue their career after having a family because they still have a relatively long career path ahead of them. I think that this is where demography has an impact on the market. 58% of female Dutch respondents believe there is equal pay between genders, compared to 81% of male Dutch respondents. Is this an expected trend? These statistics are realistic. I’ve read that 3 out of 10 women in Holland earn less than men in comparable positions. This is something that men are less aware of, which is logical. I believe in taking ownership of things, just like a man you have to be able to ask what is right for you. A man will think ‘I am valuable’. A woman may think in terms of consequences and empathy, so if the company she works for isn’t doing very well she may think ‘why should I ask for more money’. Dutch respondents under the age of 25 are less likely to think there is unequal pay between genders. Is this a trend you agree with? In Holland, when you begin your career as a young person, you see that there is much more equality between men and women. We see an increase in women obtaining a technical education and the implication here is that women are becoming better educated. This will have an impact on their career path and opportunities. This feeling of equality between the sexes also relates back to our ageing workforce. For older generations there is a perceived ‘bigger gap’ between men and women but this is not the case now as our culture continues to change and is influenced by new generations. Globally respondents (both male and female) believe that allowing more flexible working practices and changes in workplace culture through education across the business, will have the biggest impact on diversity in the workplace. What do you think about this? I think flexible working is dependent on the mind-set of a country. ‘It doesn’t matter where/when you are at work as long as you do your job’, this mentality is prevalent in Holland and still progressing. So yes I agree that flexible working hours will have a positive impact on the diversity of a workforce. Access policy is also important for diversity, it is vital for companies to have a diverse workforce across all levels.   Career planning is significant for women as well as challenging the belief that you have to be at home to be a good mother. Thinking about your career path and trying not to create a glass ceiling for yourself will help you progress. Hays Global Gender Diversity Report 2016 from Hays